Prius (2004-09) :: Engine Misfire And Intermittent CEL Flashing
Feb 11, 2014
I drove a hybrid prius for the second time ever this past Sunday and drove a whole 22 miles on open roads. This is earmarked to be the parts car, but I believe is actually in better shape than the principal car. Regardless, I'm trying to ensure the motor will be suitable for swapping into main car when needed prior to me pulling it out so I'm tinkering/driving it this next week.
The engine has a misfire, and I suspect that is the reason for the flashing orange check engine light. But what I'm not used to is that the light goes off and doesn't stay illuminated. The light comes on and flashes when any significant demand is placed on the engine-- when I nurse the throttle pedal, I can hear the engine running (I think) and there's no miss. But when I give it throttle the engine starts to miss and the CEL starts to flash. When I slow back down, the engine stops missing and the light goes off.
1) How/why the CEL flashes but then turns off?
The only background I have on this car (2008 at 225K miles) is it was taken out of service with the following writeup:
P0300 Random misfire, 0301 Misfire #1, Po302 Misfire #2 and P0101 Mass Air Flow Stored in ECM. Intermittently car only runs on 2 cyls. Suspect problem with intake due to the fact there is a recall for newer vehicles with the same condition. #1 spark plug continually getting wet with oil. Possible valve guides or ring issue allowing oil in to combustion chamber. To correct engine replacement or rebuild will be necessary.
2) What is this maf recall and might that issue apply to this 2008?
Truthfully, I only need the car to function for ~ 400 miles on a racetrack. I've been reading about the pcv valve replacement and MAF sensor cleaning. I'm considering venting the pcv line into a catch can or into the exhaust stream (to reintroduce a vacuum to the crankcase) and plugging the opening in the throttle body so there's no chance the throttle body is sucking in crankcase oil that's fouling the plugs.
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I posted this problem several months ago about a p301 code that my 2007 Prius has been generating. I eliminated all the easy stuff... plug, spark unit, fuel injector. Over the past year since I've had the car, the CEL light has gone on for a couple months then shut itself off for a couple, then back on ... probably has shut itself off 3 times in the past year, each time staying off about a month or two before coming back on. Some background on the car, supposedly the PO hit a rock and damaged the motor about 2 years ago and had the short block replaced.
Anyway, the CEL has been on again for about a month, and I got a notice for Illinois emission testing, so I decided to take it in to the dealer and have him do a diagnostic so I can get the emissions passed. After an hour and a half of testing they told me that the best they could ascertain, the car has been submerged in water, as there is a lot of rust in areas that never get any rust, and they think there's a short somewhere.
The service manager at the dealership said if it was his car he wouldn't spend the money for another 5 hours of trouble shooting, and if the car runs good he'd just drive it as is. They cleared the CEL and the service manager just charged me for an oil change as they caught a recall on the steering that hadn't been done and figured he'd let me slide on the hundred for the diagnostic.
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The dealership recommended changing the spark plugs and the air filters for the cylinder misfire issue. We are also talking about replacing the timing belt since the car has 105k miles on it. I know there are several other parts that are replaced during the timing belt replacement (like the water pump, thermostat, oil seals, etc). Is it essential to replace these items if there is no immediate need to do so?
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Before I put it away I got my brother to put some fuel stabilizer in the fuel. He now tells me that he put some in the oil too since it said "oil stabilizer" as well. It was a seafoam type brand... Not impressed with him there.
My question is could this just be the car waking up? Should I let it run for an hour or two to see if things work out?
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What is causing this to happen?
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At this point I don't have any codes and with nothing to go off of I'm at a loss. We drive it 8 miles back to our shop and it drove normally with no errors. Once it was back in the shop after turning the car on and off 10 times or so still no errors. On the last time it was in ready mode and the errors came back on, still with no codes I could read. His 12v optima was still under warranty so we got it exchanged for free even though I was reluctant that it would fix the issue. Well a week went by and all seemed to be fine until yesterday.
My dad had left the car in ready mode for probably 20 minutes and when he got back in it all the lights were on. I will also add that the battery fan was operating normally and not screaming like if there was a traction battery issue. I changed one of the modules in his traction battery about 6 months ago when one failed. Without any codes I don't know where to start with this problem. 2005 with 170k miles....
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Code P0300 was set, no cylinder specific misfire codes were present. I checked the misfire data and cylinder #6 showed tens of thousands of misfires, #5 showed several hundred, but I think it was just picking them up from #6 since #5 is right after #6 in the firing order. I disabled each injector with a scan tool, all changed the idle except #6, it did absolutely nothing. #6 fuel injector had good pulse to it, I connected a fuel pressure gauge and put power/ground to injectors #6 and #4, both dropped the same fuel pressure. I did the "cylinder deactivation" test on the scan tool for the four cylinders that have it, they all did the exact same thing - the engine bogged way down for a couple seconds and then died. Is that normal? I can't say I've ever seen a V8 engine die before when running on 6 or 7 cylinders. I checked compression on cylinder #6, it showed very low, almost zero, but I tried it a few times and it would show just a little compression at times... valves staying shut? I'm thinking when I opened the pressure relief valve on the gauge and the piston was near the bottom of the cylinder may be when it showed some compression. I also switched the coil/wire/plug from #6 to other cylinders and the miss did not follow.
Could having that screen out cause this problem? Having the engine die when deactivating the cylinders makes me wonder if maybe it's commanding all four at the same time, although the test shows each cylinder being controlled separately. Using a MODIS, not a TechII. I just got done putting in a new filter/screen to see if it would make any difference, and of course it didn't.
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I then noticed that my fuel line that feeds directly into the engine was rotten right next to the engine and if I pushed it in I could get the car to try to start. (Try and fail, but at least try.) The fuel line is a molded piece of rubber that flares at each end. It was one of the flares that was rotten and didn't seem to be sealing anymore. The hose is 7 mm inner diameter in the middle and about half an inch on the ends. I took some 3/8 in fuel line and used it to cover over one of the flares. The car tries to start now but wont. 3 of the four cylinders crank. I don't understand how I could break my car on such a simple repair job.
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The next day I took it my friend that was a Saturn mechanic and now working at a KIA dealership (same owner as the former Saturn and current Buick/GMC and Chevy Dealer). It ran fine for me. So he tries to scan it, his Mac Tools scanner won't read it. The KIA scanner wouldn't read it. I drove it the Ford dealer up the road. They said they couldn't get to it until after lunch, I just want the codes read. They re-iterated, and I told them to pound salt and went to an independent shop where I know a guy. They read it right away for me. "Mis-fire on start-up" & "Cylinder 4 Mis-fire." were the two codes stored. He cleared them.
She got the tune up basics (plugs, wires, air filter, etc) and did the complete tune-up herself yesterday. (I was impressed). She put 94 in the tank and some fuel system cleaner in it as well. She said there's been no change and today I finally saw what it was doing. Sometimes during idling at a stop light, the RPMs will drop to almost zero, the lights dim but so far it has not stalled. It'll do this for several seconds, then correct itself and idle normally.
Currently, the engine light has not come back on. She's thinking coil pack (each cylinder has a coil on these engines) on #4. She wants to switch it out with #1 and see if the problem follows. I think that might uncover the cause, or it could be the battery. It's the original, never been replaced and has a lot of miles on it, but it survived this past winter, without trouble. In my experience, most batteries crap out due to age in the fall when the cold snaps start.
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